Meeting of the Board 6:00 PM, November 28, 2009

Hyatt Regency, Dearborn


I. Call to Order at 6:06 pm Parks


II. Roll Call LeBlanc

Present: Dr. Parks, Joe LeBlanc, Bob Lusch, Dave Henderson, Julianna Wostyn, Don Chandler, Karl Mark Pall, John Chirco, Stephen Friedman, Dany Rothfeld, Mike Dennany, Chuck Fenwick, Ann and Al Bobrofsky, Ron Sirna, Mike Strub, Dan Freeland

Absent: None


III. Introduction of visitors Parks

Brian Malnar, Bill Summerell, Mike Marotta, Dan Moore, Ray Dillard, Cliff Mishler , Frank Passic, Pat Heller, Gary Keller, Jack Huggins


IV. Invocation LeBlanc

LeBlanc lead the board in prayer.


V. Minutes of Sept. 20 LeBlanc

Rothfeld moved and Pall seconded a motion to accept these as mailed to the board earlier. Motion passed.


VI. Additions to Agenda Board

Old business p: Patriot Act Education

Treasurer’s Report g: credit balances with dealers

New Business n: Anti-discrimination


VII. Approve Agenda Board

Friedman moved and Henderson seconded a motion to approve the agenda as amended; Motion passed

VIII. Director Absences LeBlanc

Director absences in the current term were enumerated: Fenwick 1, Strub 1, Lusch 3, Freeland 1 No action taken.

IX. Appointments (If any) Parks No appointments at this time.

X. Membership Comments Parks

Dan Moore – representing Monroe Coin Club – requested Fall 2010 or Spring 2010 co-sponsorship.

Fall 2010 has a 50% opening. Moore would like to accept it for his club. Wostyn moved and Friedman seconded a motion to accept the Monroe club’s request for the remaining available Fall 2010 50% show sponsorship; motion passed.

Pat Heller – has information about the patriot act – Section 352 has significant anti-money-laundering regulations against coin dealers. MI dealers have a great lack of understanding of how to comply. Liberty coin does have a compliance plan and was recently trained – an annual requirement for each employee of the company who interacts with customers. An IRS retiree with expertise in the subject is available adjacent to show hours for our Spring show, could give an hour talk to interested dealers, and could supply certificates to attendees.

Gary Keller – representing NW Detroit Coin Club – mentioned their Florence Schook Scholarship fund – They want to intensify their program, which calls for essays from young people, and our board and their coin club’s designees will judge the entries. The MichMatist would print the winning essay, which would win $100. They have awarded no money as of yet. LeBlanc had questioned the club on this status in October, since it was a few years old.

XI. Officer Reports

A. President Parks (none)

B. Vice President Al Bobrofsky (none)

C. Secretary-Treasurer LeBlanc

1. Review of current financials

a. Regular Checking Account (Nov 11, 2009) $31,100 approximately

New Liberty Bank: Demand Savings yielding 0.4%: $27,725

The Hyatt Regency required an advance payment from us – for the first time in decades - $10,000

b. Life Funds: CD $25K 4.0% Matures, Nov. 09 CD $50K 4.1% Matures, 03/10 Savings Account $27365

c. Cash Reserve: New Liberty Bank Demand Savings $10,000 yielding 0.4%

d. Pruchnicki Inheritance: New Liberty Bank CD 2.8 % Matures Nov. 09 $3655 – all encumbered at this time:

e. Encumbered Funds

1. $5000 ANA seminar April 2010

2. $10,000 ($2500 paid) ANA Schook Donation

The executive committee has the authorization from the board to pay the remaining $7500 as it sees best.

At this time LeBlanc recommends the remainder be paid in 2009, he asks the president to take a straw poll on paying the balance at this time.

Advisory vote – 8 in favor, 5 against

f. Investment of Life Funds. (Direction issue: Preferred Stock Detroit Edison ~7.5% or Multiple year Long term CD ~3%)

Sirna: Board members have fiduciary responsibility. Before such an investment, consider rating and risk diversification.

Al Bobrofsky threatened to resign if the board considered investment in a stock. LeBlanc, and Parks sensing the board did not have a solid knowledge base to consider investing in stocks deemed not to proceed on stocks.

Straw vote to consider Detroit Edison Preferred Stock Investment was therefore not held

Lusch, Al Bobrofsky moved to allow LeBlanc to invest in longer term CDs. Carried. LeBlanc will attempt to “ladder” the CD's so that they will have staggered maturities.

Rothfeld suggested that MSNS invest in gold. Several board members objected to that idea.

g. Credit Balances with dealers: We have built up a handful of dealers that are no longer attending our convention yet who have small (up to couple-hundred-dollar) credit balances with us. LeBlanc would like to send a letter, asking them if they would like us to refund their credit balances; and that if they do not respond by a certain date, LeBlanc would like them to consider their credit balances to be donations for which tax donation receipts will be issued. This would enable him to clear out the books.

Friedman asked that we instead use this as a tool for contacting the dealers and trying to get them back if they might. LeBlanc agreed, and will report to the board at the next meeting with dealer names and dollar amounts.

2. Membership Report

a. Member Totals: 1239 as follows: Regular Members 760, Young Numismatists 60, Clubs 25, Honarary Life Members 19,

Life Members 375.

3. Property Report

Still have ~8 silver anniversary medals, no longer for sale. We need lamp clamps. Summerell can make for $5 or less. Chuck Sharpe has some clamps to give us. Several members advised Summerell he could buy clamps made for lamps rather than making clamps himself.

4. 2009 Budget LeBlanc

Board was mailed a worksheet. MichMatist is over budget, as reported previously. No questions from board. The year will end in the red.

5. Fall 09 Budget LeBlanc: Work in progress. Chirco noted the defunct item of raffle, and suggested that we change our entrance signs which also still mention the raffle. Henderson asked whether we’d have another raffle. It is possible, but not probable based on expenses and work for little or no return, along with the license issue.

6. Correspondence LeBlanc We have a donation reciept from the ANA for our donation of the Michigan Paper Money book. The other two books in our library are running in a silent auction at the registration table.

Mich-TAMS – appreciated opportunity to co-host, request next available co-hosting opportunity. Dr. Parks said it may be too early for us to accept a request from them, as host clubs must wait a year before making the request – and a total of 3 years before they can repeat the duty. Dr. Chirco noted that the Grand Rapids club has already asked for a future Spring show to be outstate and for them to co-host it in that event. Dr. Parks will take under advisement. Pall requested that a straw vote be taken for going out state Spring 2012. 8 favored it, so it passed.

7. 2007 Sales Tax Refund LeBlanc No further progress on this from the hotel. $800 - $900 approximately. Sirna will discuss an approach with LeBlanc after the meeting.

8. Spring 2010 Proposed budget LeBlanc Discussion of worksheet sent to board members . Al Bobrofsky moved, Henderson 2nd, to approve it as working budget.

XII. Committee Reports

A. Exhibit Passic

Committee met – class 9 Canadian Spring, Numismatic Literature Fall. 5 sponsors for first place awards. Will be on yellow signs. Dan Freeland: purpose of committee is to educate. Therefore, he proposed, and Rothfeld seconded, this motion:

We the exhibit committee, recommend to rescind the rule passed on November 27, 2004 that the best of show winner in each class may accept a ½ oz. gold bullion in lieu of the trip to Colorado if they so chose. This provision will take effect January 1, 2010.

Out of 12-14 conventions, the gold option has been taken 3 times – twice by an adult and once by a YN. Board members further noted that the reason for taking the gold option is usually reasonable, e.g. health-based travel restrictions, or inability of a parent to accompany a minor who is a winner.

VOTE: In favor of rescinding the gold option: failed Therefore the current ½ oz option remains.

B. Webmaster Report Marotta

Mike Marotta invited questions. Dennany said he had requests for software for online sign-ups for tables at future shows. Marotta is considering it now. Credit Cards can’t be taken because of high fees. Marotta may request a new hosting firm.

C. Auctions Summerell

No current discussions at this time.

D. Past Presidents Ann Bobrofsky

In the past there have been funds for an appreciation dinner for dignitaries that are in attendance. The board without motion agreed that the President should have authorization to take out such dignitaries and expense the amount to MSNS.

When we received our jackets, they were able to be kept by the receiver, or they could optionally be returned. Some have questioned whether they should be allowed to continue wearing them. Some feel that past Presidents could continue. Wostyn moved that all past presidents that have jackets may continue to wear them. Dennany seconded. Passed.

E. Mich-Matist Rothfeld No committee meeting recently, but Rothfeld discussed with several people. 73 advertisers paying $10,500. Strub is doing a good job. Strub would like help for some to sell more advertisements. Friedman – let’s tell people at the show how the point system gives them credit for their ads. Chirco suggested that larger ads ought to get more points. Ann Bobrofsky pointed out that the bourse applications used to feature the point system.

F. Publicity Strub LeBlanc thanked director Pall – Pall did extensive work to get us Channel 2 and WJR radio – it looks like we had some success. We also have a nice membership brochure.

G. Membership Chandler

Henderson suggested early access to all members to our shows. To be addressed later in board meeting.

Chandler – we still seek reasons for joining the association. LeBlanc noted that at todays YN meeting MSNS gave a gold coin by raffle to one YN member of MSNS. This caused a flood of new YN applicants! New members are getting a free book. Some discussion about rescinding this deal. LeBlanc offered that books can be given to board members to take to other shows to give away to new MSNS applicants for membership at shows they host. Dr. Parks stated this would be done on an availability basis. Chandler suggested that we lean toward giving Redbooks to the new member YNs. This we strive to do, but give them a choice.

H. Conv./Manual Revision Al Bobrofsky Al thanked Wostyn for her work. Board has received a draft version. Send your comments to Parks or Bobrofsky before next meeting. Roseanne Parks also worked on the project.

I. Club Outreach/Communication Clubs Wostyn Wostyn says there is no mini-show update because no club has come forward. Mike Dennany will do leg work to find 3 open dates between Sept 2010 and May 2011 that don’t conflict with any other show within 150 mile radius of Grand Rapids area. Wostyn will get info on a venue that could host about 75 tables.

Wostyn says clubs are starting to read her letters as a matter of business. We will look into the possibility that if the ANA countertfeit detection class goes on, a few of us will tell the local clubs about it.

J. Education Pall Pall thanks Chirco for working in the Western Michigan field, especially with the YNs. Reports of events that ran today are that it went very well. The Paper Money Round Table was very successful. Parks wants the round table to become a regular event. Pall requested a commitment from Mishler to moderate in the future. Mishler replied, tongue in cheek, that it depended on who the speaker might be.

K. Finance Parks Parks has reviewed and things look good.

L. Dealer Dennany Rothfeld mentioned a supply dealer we’ve had for 15 years in a secondary spot who has been waiting for a preferred position, but was passed over in favor of a dealer with a lower seniority. Parks referred this situation to the dealer committee.

Friedman said some board members are upset by his survey. (he passed out a survey to dealers at this convention) At the Houston show, they always give a survey at each show to each dealer. Friedman would like to add some people to the dealer committee – Malnar, Wostyn … Parks approved.

Chirco – dealers want to know why they must pick up their badges at one end of the building, then walk to the other end. Answer: security and geography of the hotel.

XIII. Old Business

A. Schlag Memorial Update Al Bobrofsky $2865 in the bank. Trying to come up with last $1400. Design of monument was presented to the board in the form of a wall hanging available for $250 as a fund raiser.

B. MSNS Attire LeBlanc Website that sold the blazers was wholesale only. Vendor in Plymouth can buy them for us therefore. Jackets are coming, shirts are mostly in except for two. Jackets due in February or earlier.

C. Suburban Detroit Coin Show Wostyn Was last Halloween weekend. 20 members signed up. Next is Feb 4-5-6; Henderson, Freeland, Wostyn will work, she asks 1 more for Thursday and Friday. Thanks the Freeland's, Larry Sekulich and LeBlanc for manning table in October.

D. ANA Seminar Spring 10 LeBlanc (need to firm up 1 day or 2 day) LeBlanc: Has been approved, money is encumbered. Tuition set at $149 for ANA and MSNS members, $199 for non if 1 day. Higher for 2-day. Straw vote: 1-day: 11 votes. Seminar will thus be 1 day. Parks said he would like to see annual event. Chirco says CSNS says we’re eligible for $200 support for speakers.

E. Mini Show Update Wostyn Discussed earlier.

F. Dealer Packet Contents Wostyn Wostyn acquired some food coupons and a rolled 5c elongate.

G. Dealer survey Friedman would like to know why dealers stop coming to our conventions.

H. Badges, Dealers Lanyard Wostyn A laminated ID card can be printed by our printer who does the Michmatist, printed on both sides, a different primary color for each convention, featuring personalization of business and person name. Cost for 500 would be ~$299. similar to what we pay now. Lanyards would be ~25 cents each. Dennany moved, Chandler seconded that we go ahead and get these printed. No vote necessary. Discussion of lanyards advertising TeleTrade – decision not to do so, but to pay for lanyards that are blank or say MSNS.

1. Photo ID’s Henderson No discussion.

I. Co-Host Awards LeBlanc (Monroe already awarded Fall 2010 at top of meeting)

J. CSNS Show in Michigan LeBlanc No progress – CSNS has semi-long-term contract with Chicago.

K. ANA Show in Michigan LeBlanc Cliff Mishler: An ANA convention in Detroit is not feasible because of the reputation of the city. This despite his personal history of having enjoyed many conventions in our state. An ANA convention in Michigan would have to be in “Detroit”. 1994 convention was difficult to carry out because of a strong lobby against Detroit, and that has gotten stronger. ANA now looking into a small fixed set of cities and possibly a wildcard city outside of them. MSNS will continue to attempt to secure an ANA show.

L. ICTA membership (tabled 9/09) LeBlanc Taken back off the table from last meeting. Rothfeld called and spoke with Diane, their secretary. Didn’t get packet of information in time. ICTA was instrumental in repealing the coin sales tax in Michigan. We can have a membership for $300. $300 annual dues is recommended for a club of our size. Motion passed for us to join for $300 as a dues payment. We will attempt to use ICTA for dealer education hence forth.

M. Waiting period for any non-budget Bobrofsky Spending request (Tabled 9/09). NOT taken back off the table after tabling from last meeting, Rothfeld moved to un-table, but no second to do so.

N. VCR Library to DVD LeBlanc Nothing to report

O. VCR Loan to Members LeBlanc Since we can only loan to member clubs, but not to members, LeBlanc asks the board to reconsider. Dennany moved and Strub seconded a motion to reconsider and allow members to borrow said tapes; motion passed.

P. Patriot Act Education Rothfeld Rothfeld asserted the need for a private individuals’ training to be offered to MSNS dealers, and explained how this individual is trying to drum up business by giving a talk for a fee of $1500, but might reduce his fee based on business he drums up in terms of dealers employing him to assist them individually.

Strub said he feels this is a bit of a scam. The dealers at risk have not been defined, therefore all dealers are being scared into believing they may not be in compliance. He feels that it shouldn’t require an expensive consultant to find out how to read and comply with a government regulation.

Sirna said that ICTA can help us understand this and that we should not be in the business of supporting private interests like this.

XIV. New Business

A. Counterfeit coin concerns Dennany We need to voice our concerns to the FBI and etc. to take more action against this threat. Parks feels this will be of little effect, but that we should support ANA, ANS, CSNS, etc. in fighting this threat.

B. CSNS Election Ballot LeBlanc (4 Michigan people running, can only vote for 3) We can cast a vote for up to 10 members of the CSNS board, 3 maximum from Michigan. The 4 from Michigan are board members Dennany, LeBlanc, and Henderson, plus member Brett Irick. Parks feels that we should not vote. Henderson missed the deadline for a biography in the ballot mailing, so he asked that he be dropped from our consideration. Henderson moved and Chirco seconded that we vote for the other 3 MSNS members. Approved.

LeBlanc states that he will fill out the ballot, and will mail to Dr Parks to have him officially mail and cast our ballot since LeBlanc would have a conflict of interest if only he saw the MSNS ballot.

C. MSNS Election LeBlanc Next MichMatist should call for nominations. President must appoint a committee or CPA to handle counting. At this time he appoints Pat Heller as a CPA. Board approved.

D. 2009 Taxes Hire Accountant LeBlanc LeBlanc asks authorization to hire accountant. Jack Huggins appointed by motion of Bobrofsky, second by Hendrickson, approved.

E. Insurance Renewals LeBlanc

1. LeBlanc requested up to $1250 to pay for Errors and Omissions (board negligence) coverage - limits to be the same as in the past. Friedman moved and Chirco seconded a motion to do so, which passed.

2. Liability up to $900 LeBlanc requests renewal authorization. Moved and seconded. Approved.

3. Bond of up to $500 LeBlanc requests authorization. Lusch moved and Chandler 2nd. Approved a motion to approve this expenditure. LeBlanc asked board to give executive committee authority to approve issues relating to renewal. LeBlanc states there may be some paperwork to file. Pall moved, and received a verbal second. Approved.

F. Storage Yard Renewal LeBlanc LeBlanc requests approval to renew. Dennany moved and Lusch seconded a motion to pay up to $1400 to renew our storage fees, which passed

G. Membership Dues LeBlanc LeBlanc asks if the board wishes to change the dues structure. Board remains silent with no motion was made.

H. Purchase of exhibit awards in advance LeBlanc Under current policy we can’t purchase exhibit awards until a budget for the convention has been approved. Rothfeld moved and Dennany seconded a motion to allow the exhibit chairman in conjunction with the secretary treasurer to purchase exhibit awards up to 3 conventions in advance. Passed.

I. Annex Traffic Concerns Chirco At this time, Chirco withdrawals agenda item.

J. Early entry for members to the Bourse Chandler Chandler proposed early entry, at 9am, for members to our 2010 Spring Show’s second day, Saturday. LeBlanc said this wouldn’t impact our early bird sales. Friedman wants to know what the dealers want before we make such a decision. Friedman asked that no action be taken until further discussion at February 2010 board meeting.

K. Proposal to suspend free books to New members Chandler

(Sec/Trea note: books already purchased per motion 9/09) Agenda item Withdrawn by Chandler.

L. Proposal to give all new YN’s book(s) Chandler Moot. Already being done.

M. Proposal to give YN Pages free book(s) Chandler Agenda item withdrawn by Chandler.

N. Anti-discrimination LeBlanc Insurance agency may need us to have a formal policy against discrimination. Sirna to write up a policy if needed. Dennany moved and Al Bobrofsky seconded a motion that Sirma prepare such, which passed.

XV. Board Member Comments

Parks: Tomorrow a presidential award is to be given at the breakfast.

Wostyn – let’s stop rumors

Dennany – ditto

Lusch – ditto

XVI. General Membership Comments Hearing none.

XVII. Adjourn 9:55pm